Can You Hear A Tomato Cry..." 2774

My mistake, careless wording. The point is that it is non-conscious, and therefore available to lobsters and humans.

Of course they do. If their brains do not respond then they do not detect the stimulus. If they detect it, then the brain will respond. Heat was used as an example of pain. Clearly, it would need to be more than mild heat. I didn't think I needed to spell that out.

No, not specifically. It ought to be obvious. Any organism that cannot detect temperature will not survive.

Jeez, can you really be that obtuse?

If you will put down, oh, say, $100K, I'll match it. Then I'll set up a little experiment. I'll construct a lobster tank large enough so that one part of it can be heated without significantly affecting the rest. I'll put 30-40 lobsters in the tank and let them mill about. If necessary, I'll add food or whatever to get them to spread out across the tank.

Then, I'll apply heat to one area of the tank. I'm betting that the lobsters all move away from that area. Then I'll apply tyhe heat to another area, and I bet that they then move away from that area.

Winner takes the $200K.

Yes, mammals are different than crustaceans (I'm startimg to wonder about you, but then you may not be a mammal), but not in this aspect. At least, the basic (pain/aversion) mechanism is very similar.

Of course. An accutate but irrelevant observation. Almost all organisms will be wired to detect temperature.

If you define "pain" as the aversive response that causes them to avoid light, then yes. Whether they are "aware" of it in the sense of consciousness, no. Not lobsters either.

Except to bore us with that useless comment.

This is the part I love the most. Thes usenet posers get in over their heads and want out. What do they do, they fire off a parting shot and declare that they are done. Won't respond anymore. Not gonna do it. Cowards.

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